Okay, starting to dislike the MKIV

[sflemon]

None of this will stop the BT stuff later, but I'm pissed. This is mostly rant.......so........don't take at face value........and a big thanks to Matt, Travis, Brad when the car broke down for helping out.

========================
Why in the hell does a car need an electronic throttle? That's stupid as shit, and expensive. Not to mention the failure mode is backwards and unsafe. When the damn thing failed it just floored the gas, and that ain't slow on my car. It should fail and go to a no-gas situation.

That's dangerous as hell. Who went to work drunk that day in Wolfsburg? I should try to call VWoA to see if I can get anything out of this.

I swear, VW or not, unless it has a warranty, I'm not buying another car with any of these:

a. electronic throttle body
b. OBDII emissions requirements
c. won't run if a single stupid thing fails totally unrelated to the fuel & fire principle (if you have air, gas, a spark, and a starter, it will run)
d. electronic shocks, brake pad wear sensors, etc......
e. any number of other lame stuff to fail that's not a basic component needed to run a motor

I'm soooooooo fed up with this shit. It's just retarded you can run freaking nitrometh in your car with 1.5x stock power and be fine, but have some stupid shit fail unrelated to anything and the damn thing won't run.

Give me something mechanical over electrical ANYDAY. I hate it when something electrical that's considered a "luxury" fails and prevents the item from functioning.

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH DAMNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNIIIIIIIIIIII TTTTTTTTTT

:rifle: :rifle::rifle: :mad: :mad: :mad: :smack: :smack:


I might as well go down the list on items to fail to not be able to drive or drive safely:

a. wheel bearings: done
b. throttle body: done
c. maf: done
d. coils: done
e. starter: not done
f. alternator: not done
g. battery: 1 yr old, done
h. fuel pump: working on it, BT stuff
I. map: not done
j. Main O2 sensor: not done
k. brake pads: not done, have life left
l. tires: done
m. clutch posn. sensor: not done
n. brake posn. sensor: done
o. accel pedal: will be done now that its sorry ass broke
p. turbo: will be done on BT
q. timing belt stuff: done, have 40k miles left
r. water pump: done
s. oil pump: will be done on BT build
t. coil distribution thingy: might have been done, need to check
u. accessory belt/tensioner: done
v. cam chain/tension (all that shit): not done, BT stuff, something to look at
w. cam posn sensor: not done
x. green top: done
y. thermostat: not done, BT stuff
z. I know there's more.


Okay, I'm calmed down now. :wanker:

[evan@absolute]

just to make you feel better or not Stan almost all cars have those and many have more things that will stop it in it's tracks. The thing about dbw is it gives you cruise, traction control and the ecu has the ability to save the motor by closing the throttle. The throttle may fail from time to time but I swear if I had had a 1.8t mk4 to build 20 years ago instead of a 1.5l beetle or a 1.6l mk1 it would have been super sick. For all it's short comings technology has made tuning cars 10000 times easier then 20 years ago. I mean jam some boost in with some fuel and timing and worst case the ecu closes the throttle before you blow the top off. How easy is that. The dbw system is able to open the throttle slowly or quickly. With lots of the BT files they tune them to open the throttle slowly to help keep the spool under control. On my car the throttle is only open 80-85% thru the boost spike range before it opens the rest of the way. I just hold my foot down:upyeah: And I really do hold it down:gt-ogb-spank::gt-ogb-spank::gt-ogb-spank::gt-ogb-spank:

[afinley]

i think its time to buy that TT stan

[zooyork155]

You both make good points.

On one hand the newer technology allows tuning to progress more quickly and more safely but it reaches a point where you're fighting to try and overcome so much of the computer/electronic control.

[sflemon]

I know......Evan's right.

I'm just frustrated.

But, now I have no excuse not to be loaded the entire weekend long since I won't be driving. I may as well buy a 40 and chug it down before leaving the mall tomorrow.

Hell, there's still time to get loaded tonight.

[Vampire Cockroach]

these are the reasons I'm thinking of staying away from buying another mk4. They are great when they run right, but too many little things are deficient in little ways, and all those little parts are always needing to be replaced it seems.

[8------D]

it's only gonna get more complicated and you won't be able to run old ass cars all the time

if you want obd1, you are now looking at 12-13 year old cars.

just embrace new technology....it will be easier.


oh yeah.... and on the whole nitromethane thing. you WILL blow up your engine if you continue that.

[afinley]

it isnt that mk4s or 1.8ts break alot, its any car that you double the horsepower on, and then use to go to the grocery store.

[a4wdhybrid]

everything fails...electronic, mechanical, whatever..sooner or later its going to fail...

bojan makes a really good point too...obd1 is going to be <96...and youre complaining about parts failing on an '01 car?

[8------D]

i was just talking about this with my best friend who lives in chicago. he drives the same POS...'96 m3 and he hates the car. im tired of it as well.

fact is new cars are so much stiffer and torsionally more rigid. im not talking about "get suspension and be done with it". that shit does not work. it makes the car handle like crap because setting proper damping is actually difficult thing to do. not only that but all new cars welds and various chasis reinforcements are technologically superior. look at the torsional rigidity in Hertz of all newer cars. simple chevy malibu has stronger chasis than e36 m3. freaking rx-8 is up there with p-cars. they have reinforcements and crossmembers on the roof. simple fact is that any 2000+ focus handles better than my car. steering is actually more responsive and the entire car feels stiffer and stronger.

...and all this is just suspension/chassis aspect. i am not even getting into safety, economy, and performance. new V6 camrys, avalons, accords have all in excess of 250hp. avalons are like 280 something. i can pride on E36 m3 BMW and 1.8T chip+exhaust+tip+this+that, but lets not kid here... all the new cars are BETTER and they are getting progressively faster and more economical. new 335i with 300hp gets 29 on the highway. z06 gets 26mpg on highway from a 7.0L 505hp engine. who are we kidding here?

the only reason to want an old car ragged out obd1 is because of two things:
1) you feel comfortable working on one
2) it is special in some way..you like the marque or whatever

thats it!

having said all that im sick and tired of old ass cars that make noises in summer, in winter. im tired of squeaks and whistles and something that sounds like an old belt whistling, but it is actually a tensioner. oh wait, maybe it is not, it might be VANOS. ah, shit i hope not....let me just drive the motherfucker and hope it doesnt breakdown.
im tired of that.

i want nice, clean, quiet, comfortable ride that handles well, smells good, attracts women when they sit in it, has warranty and new car smell. in fact i want '04 B6 S4 or sports package e90 330i. sporty, sexy, masculine, succint, clean, performing and most importanly new.

/end of rant.

[sflemon]

What I want (and won't happen if I keep priorities straight):

1. Daily driver: something with a warranty, newer A3/A4 or something
2. Track bitch: engineered, tube chassis, LS1 mid engine powered, home brew/kit car
3. Daily sleeper: something like a MK1 with a 1.8T BT or the Jetta I have now with a biiig turbo
4. A cheap pickup truck and a cheap trailer: maybe 2000 miles a year, to dragstrip or track and back only

[afinley]

get a TT, drive it for what it is, quick, 4wd, reliable. then rag the crap out of the jetta.

[Vampire Cockroach]

i am just kinda tired of being a 1.8t fanboy

my priorities:

1. get money
2. fuck bitches
3. party like a rockstar

[8------D]

my priorities:

1. get money
2. fuck bitches
3. party like a rockstar

2. should be 1.

[Vampire Cockroach]

well 1 definitely aids in getting 2 done

thats why its first, its sorta a sequence of events if you will :D

[No_B00st]

yeah my to do list

1) dump obnoxious girlfriend
2) get another can of rolling tobacco
3) Get good grades
4) Buy B5 S4.

[No_B00st]

oh and i forgot:

5) Helke's momma

[Vampire Cockroach]

wow we college kids are so insightful... :rolleyes::D

[Couga]

Older (pre-OBD1) Cars can have pluses and minuses as well.

Ya just need to decide what you want to do with This car. You built it to run ( getting ready for a BT setup) stuff is going to break. replacing parts cost $$$. when you make one thing stronger, the weakest part is up to go next.

Looking at what the cost for the mods for my subie I realized that for newer cars it pays to play, think of what you have spent on your car (initial investment + mods) and think of what else you could have bought.

I'll have to agree with Bojan, next new car will be simple, nice, and clean. Prolly a Audi or a BMW. Something I can put my family in and drive for long distances, be comfortable, ride in style, and not worry about breaking down.
Only mods it will ever see is a drop and a set of wheels.

I almost went on my own rant and did a threadjack but I omitted a good part of it.

older cars in my oppinion are a easier to tune and maintain, but that's because I have messing with these for along time. sure you can upgrade the ignition, brakes, fuel, but your doing that to an older car.


Ya can't take your daily, turn it into a racecar and expect it be reliable.. Been that route before...

[jnecr]

I swear, VW or not, unless it has a warranty, I'm not buying another car with any of these:

a. electronic throttle body
b. OBDII emissions requirements
c. won't run if a single stupid thing fails totally unrelated to the fuel & fire principle (if you have air, gas, a spark, and a starter, it will run)
d. electronic shocks, brake pad wear sensors, etc......
e. any number of other lame stuff to fail that's not a basic component needed to run a motor


Sounds like what you really need is a TDI... :) Then you won't have a throttle body at all!!

[afinley]

or B, and maybe not D

[RogerBrunswick]

Sorry for your troubles but, I say screw the MK IV and get a MK III VR6... Just a thought.

[FatBastrd]

No comment..... :rolleyes:

[Vampire Cockroach]

Sorry for your troubles but, I say screw the MK IV and get a MK III VR6... Just a thought.

OH MY GOD speaking of problems... :D :gt-ogb-spank: :laff:


stan, this seems like mroe of a 1.8t themed thread... not all MK4's are bad... my 2.0 had 1 problem that was not scheduled-maintenance-oriented and that was the catalytic converter failure... and was covered under warranty..

[DJMario]

well stan, let me know when you're ready to sell the downpipe and exhaust!

[afinley]

yo nessicito el downpipe!

[Blindside337]

What I want (and won't happen if I keep priorities straight):

1. Daily driver: something with a warranty, newer A3/A4 or something
2. Track bitch: engineered, tube chassis, LS1 mid engine powered, home brew/kit car
3. Daily sleeper: something like a MK1 with a 1.8T BT or the Jetta I have now with a biiig turbo
4. A cheap pickup truck and a cheap trailer: maybe 2000 miles a year, to dragstrip or track and back only



i agree with you stan. thats why i decided to not go bt or anything on my gti since if i just buy a transmission for the crx it will kill a bt gti no offense lol.

1. 337 gti as dd, just body mods, a chip and bolt ons. really to me a good dd is something good on gas, looks decent and is reasonably quick in case ricers appear;)
2. track bitch = the crx, this car on a stock h22 with slicks and a shot of gas hit 7.60s in the 1/8 and with my built engine and a shot of gas will be quite a bit better. but i can find parts decently cheap and will have under 6k in the car when done.
3. im not much for a sleeper the crx could be minus the h22 valve cover sticking through the cut out in the hood lol. but i am looking for a 65-67 chevelle to restore and do a ls2 swap on.
4. truck = hell yes! either keeping my xtreme and putting a posi disk brake rear end in it and pulling the crx with a tow dolly or going for a duramax and a decent size double axle trailer.

[Blindside337]

just to make you feel better or not Stan almost all cars have those and many have more things that will stop it in it's tracks. The thing about dbw is it gives you cruise, traction control and the ecu has the ability to save the motor by closing the throttle. The throttle may fail from time to time but I swear if I had had a 1.8t mk4 to build 20 years ago instead of a 1.5l beetle or a 1.6l mk1 it would have been super sick. For all it's short comings technology has made tuning cars 10000 times easier then 20 years ago. I mean jam some boost in with some fuel and timing and worst case the ecu closes the throttle before you blow the top off. How easy is that. The dbw system is able to open the throttle slowly or quickly. With lots of the BT files they tune them to open the throttle slowly to help keep the spool under control. On my car the throttle is only open 80-85% thru the boost spike range before it opens the rest of the way. I just hold my foot down:upyeah: And I really do hold it down:gt-ogb-spank::gt-ogb-spank::gt-ogb-spank::gt-ogb-spank:


it isnt just mk4s or volkswagens, i agree on that. my accord stopped going from 3rd to 4th at 90 just stopped. was at flow honda for 1 week, they couldnt figure it out and my brother's for 2 months before he touched it and all it was was a f'ing ground. i have had to replace several sensors since ive had it all of which made it not run or barely run. its not just vws.

now you dont need to feel bad at all, my xtreme s10 has had more problems than half the cars on this board. burnt 4 fuel pumps which are around 300 a piece, we had at one time replaced EVERY part of the firing system to get it to run right, right now it wont crank due to who knows what, something electrical, the 3rd and 4th gear quit working thought tranny was gone, replaced it and then 1st and 4th wouldnt work, turns out something was burnt in the harness on it. their is more cash in fixing shit that went wrong so far than in buying the truck, the paint and all the mods.

i would love to say i wouldnt buy another obd2 vehicle but if you get any vehicles 95 or older your looking at HIGH miles and more problems and less reliability. for a dd i dont want to go for anything high performance or try to modify it much since shit goes wrong.

and as far as reliable cars dohc 3000gt's and eclipses are shit when you start modding them, and very expensive to fix. my first car was a 3000gt and it was the biggest piece i ever had, the sohc dsms and 3S's are decent cars but the dohcs are shit. not even lying, i knew a guy that had spent over 30k on a gsx eclipse just fixing it in 5 years.

[kcfoxie]

Mom's 2002 Focus (Fucked Us) Wagon SE:

3 x Rear Hatch Seals (leaked the day she picked it up)
3 x Driver Side rear light assemblies (one from accident, two from water leakage)
2 x Throttle Bodies
3 x Radios
1 x Wiper Motor
1 x Ignition Switch
1 x Headgasket
2 x Sets of Rotors and Pads on the FRONT ONLY
1 x Set of Shoes for the REAR DRUM BRAKES (HOW 70s can we get???)
1 x Fuel Pump

This car just turned 54,000 miles today and was purchased with 10 miles on the odo. Ford Extended warranty FTW... else they'd be so in debt to the thing it would really hurt. POS, total POS. My Airbag light is miniscule in comparison. This car has quit on the highway, refused to start, refused to shift into drive, refused to turn the wipers on... it's been a total lemon. At some 9,000 mi annually, and being babies by a woman who survived being hit front and rear simultaneously in her last accident, it shouldn't fall apart. But it does.

Now all cars are made equal, not all of the same Make are made equal, all cars have problems -- see the signature.

Glad you've gotten over it some tho :)

[Ak-Abe]

My next car is going to be either a WRX STI or a Lancer EVO X... they both have good power , handle amazing, look good (at least i think they do ) and if you want more power just chip them... I am tired of noise , squeeks and other small stuff.. .BUT i still love my 1.8T it has been through allot and i have spent some money on it......But it is also my daily driver thank god it is been good for a daily driver.

[kcfoxie]

My next car is going to be either a WRX STI or a Lancer EVO X... they both have good power , handle amazing, look good (at least i think they do ) and if you want more power just chip them... I am tired of noise , squeeks and other small stuff.. .BUT i still love my 1.8T it has been through allot and i have spent some money on it......But it is also my daily driver thank god it is been good for a daily driver.
Wait for the Subie Waterboxer Diesel engine in 09.

[sflemon]

Hetzen's car is a prime example of what I love in a VW, and dislike in a lot of other 4-banger track cars.

It can be a freak in da sheets and run 11's in the 1/4, and put on the nice shoes and go out on the town.
Not a daily driver, but much nicer to pick up a date with than a shelled out turd if you choose to drive that car.

[Blindside337]

next car here will either be a 00 or so 911, 67 chevelle built and rolling on 18/20s or build a k1 attack, discovered how bad the attacks are the other night. within the next year probably.

[Vampire Cockroach]

I am tired of noise , squeeks and other small stuff..

oh my god... please don't get an evo or an sti then... :gt-lgb-paranoid::gt-lgb-paranoid::m-kay:

[Yareka]

My next car is going to be either a WRX STI or a Lancer EVO X...

ban...no more beer pong partner for you pal.

[a4wdhybrid]

the ppl that hate evo's are the ppl that have never driven an evo

[Vampire Cockroach]

oh they are great cars... but after a while they start to rattle.. well moreso the STi's than Evo's... but they all end up rattling pretty badly after time

Everything inside is plastic..

[Blindside337]

my car rattles sometimes not often just on crap roads. and considering i live in stokes county crap roads to me are borderline to being gravel, full of bumps cracks and such lol. like road construction zones thats when i rattle.

[Couga]

My 2003 subie wrx didn't rattle at all, and it had 65k on it when I sold it.
Frank swears mine wasn't stock, but all that I know was on the car was a aftermarket boost gauge and XM radio.

Total blast to drive, my first experience in a awd car, and if I had it to do again I would have gotten a STI.

I have yet to ride/drive a audi, and look forward to doing that one day ( for comparison reasons)

If I had kept it, I prolly would have chipped it, lowered is a lil , and changed the wheels- that's it.
maybe an exhaust...

Never drove and evo but I'm game to see what the hype is about.

waiting for the release of the GTR in the states.., just waiting....

[Blindside337]

for the price of a gtr you could get a new z06...everyone that knows me knows i cant stand new vettes for certain reasons but hey for the price of a new z its your best deal in a performance car under 100k.

[pyroboy1850]

not all mkIV have problems my 8v never has problems except for my dumbass forgeting to hook a censor back up and is the cause for my check engine light my engine hasnt given me any problems my transmission is what is giving me problems 2nd gear synchros